In Toronto With Indian Families

Bapuji In Toronto With Indian Families

July 30, 1977 am

[Bapuji speaks in Gujarati and Gurudev translates]


Bapuji says at the key time if we cannot help the other, then we have no relation, then we cannot say that ‘I love you’, you know?

Because everybody says ‘I love you, I love you.’ But without self-sacrifice and service, and patience, love is not possible.

Self-sacrifice, service and patience, love is not possible, Bapuji says.

[Someone else speaks in Gujarati]

GURUDEV [translating]:

Bapuji says there cannot be a large group of the lovers, of your lovers.

But that is possible that we can love a large group of people and not hate anyone.

But the real, mutual love relationship cannot be in a very large scale.

If we cannot love, it’s okay, but we should not hate at least.

[There’s a lot of noise with the microphone; tape interruption]


Christ said the similar situation, that he had not done, performed any action that would justify his being on the cross, but when he was taken on the cross he said ‘My Lord, Thy will be done.’ Then think that his sadhana must be very extraordinary ordinary compared to ordinary person.

And yet, such a big difficulty.

He was slightly disturbed, but as soon as he became steady, he realized that whatever is happening is all right.

Bapuji says ‘May I tell you the secret?

If he had not accepted the cross, he would have never been world famous accepted by the world.’ His very specialty, his very greatness came out in this form.

(Gurudev comments: What a beautiful way of saying this!)

God brings anyone into the light in his own way.

Not in the individual’s way.

We are all ordinary sadhaks small.

If we get into difficulties, we can just sit and cry about it.

At that time, we must we should to the Lord ‘this is just a small suffering.’

With yoga is I can even take care of a mountain of troubles by your grace.

But that is possible only if there is love.

To do sadhana is one thing; to be a sadhak is one thing, and to run the centers is altogether different thing.

Those two have no relation.

Bapuji says ‘Yes, it is true that yoga center is a tool of sadhana, through that you can grow.’ Because when we teach others, we are also studying.

So, when the owner goes for a journey the driver owner of the car is travelling, the driver also gets the travelling benefit.

This way, when we teach others, many of our problems are resolved, as long as as our questions remain questions, how can we have the opportunity to become the teacher?

As long as one has not found the answers to one’s own questions, he is not fit to teach.

Some answers to some questions are found from the books.

Some answers are found from within.

And some answers we find from our own sadhana.

And some answers we find from guru.

So, when we find all the solutions and we see the harmony in all of them, then we found the answers.

The question is properly solved only when our heart says whatever it says is properly said the same thing is said by the guru, same thing we find in the scripture.

And same thing our sadhana says, and there it is a harmony among all of those.

Only when it happens that, then one can truly grow.

Because usual methods of understanding or seeing the saints are wrong.

Suppose I am if I have hundred thousand of disciples, because I have thousands and thousands of disciples, you cannot just say that this is a saint.

The saint is recognized by his actions.

His heart would be so pure that it will touch the hearts of others.

And yet he is pure.

And yet some who touch other’s heart could not be pure not necessarily pure.

Those good orators that are those who speak so well, there are other orators who can even speak better than them.

If they put actors in front of them, they will all be defeated, cause actors can speak better.

Because they can speak with such feelings, and can touch the hearts of others so effectively, that the listeners are enchanted.

So when the actor speaks, it does not have a long term effect, if it affects, it just dies in a short time. But the saint cannot speak as good as the actor.

And yet, he touches the heart so deeply that it lasts for a lifetime.

So the saint must have a character.

It is very easy to speak on peace, on generosity, and all these higher qualities they are very easy to talk about, but very hard to practice.

There could be a true mango and there could be an imitation mango.

As long as one doesn’t become a pure saint, it is that imitation saint.

One must continuously go through the self-observation.

In Malav once, when I was there, I was a little bit disappointed and so the disciples saw that and they were also disappointed.

We all got together and you came to me.

All the disciples were in front of you.

[noise moving the microphone] [inaudible] beheld their pain and started crying.

Gurudev reached me and forgive us me, I made a mistake.

Bapuji said “I made a mistake that I became disappointed.”

Then they all started a laughing.

Then they all got healthy.

That must be such a deep love that ten, fifteen people who had come, they didn’t argue about anything, they had just come to say that “Gurudev, we made a mistake”, and they all started crying.

Unique way.

This is the right form of truth.

Whatever is truth has a form of this nature.

One who does self-observation properly, he never sees the fault of other, he finds a fault in himself.

That is the real sign of true self observation.

One who can see where I have a mistake, he can be the true traveler of the right path.

Amrit has just asked me a question as to how to begin the self observation.

That self-observation cannot be done successfully right away.

For that you take it takes a little time.

Because it has many different stages.

For that you have to pass on the earlier stages and then learn from it gradually.

So if you take out any one of those steps, then that much, the self-observation won’t suffer that much.

Whenever we are performing some action one part of our mind must be must observe it objectively.

This is not possible all of a sudden.

This we can do little we can see little bit when we are peaceful, or when we are steady.

But when we are disturbed, we can’t see any of it.

So, when one has grown, then even in such a disturbed state, one portion of the mind always remains objective, then even in such a disturbed state, one portion of the mind always remains objective and constantly observes it, it means, a witness.

The witness stays alive all the time.

As long as one does not have the objectivity in this observation and have the capacity to judge things properly, one cannot properly grow.

It is very difficult to remain objective when you pick up one of the sides.

Under that circumstances we can never go through the proper self analysis.

One has to keep a wakeful attitude in oneself that I want to know my own faults and I need to increase my good qualities.

As long as that determination is not firm, self-observation is not possible.

First stages that as soon as you hear some descriptions or understanding about self-observation, you are very impressed by it, that is a first stage, is to be impressed by the idea.

Unless you become first familiar, how can we ever begin with it?

First you are introduced, then gradually you begin to enter into it.

Any individual who has excelled in any field that individual must have to some degree excelled in self-observation.

It just also so happens that any individual he is about to grow on a very high stage.

This begins from the very childhood.

The essence of the higher qualities are already visible from the very childhood.

I’ll give you one example of my own life.

I had my music school in Ahmedabad.

So my sister’s son, about eight years old, his name was Radnikant, used to live with me.

Whenever this music school was on, he used to just sit in the corner.

And I was my attention was going towards him occasionally.

So I felt that maybe he likes music little bit, so he may be sitting there.

This was sometime past.

One day I had been out, and I returned home.

At that time, he was singing a song that I was teaching on the third standard of music third stage of music.

And he was singing the most difficult thing.

First I could not recognize as to who was singing that.

I stood up silent.

As long as he sang I heard it thoroughly and waited out.

Until then I was unable to figure out who was singing so well.

As soon as I entered the building I saw him playing.

He was very young, eight years.

I just picked him up and loved him a lot.

‘You sing so well, now you attend my classes regularly.’ Then I started paying attention on him.

Really the chant was better the way he was studying.

Now on I started paying attention to him.

I was always checking a way that he was attending or not.

I was getting angry when he was absent.

Very easy.

I loved him very much.

Bapuji says, he was ‘I headed up all my students’ and he didn’t know anything of the lower standards but he was singing highest in the best way.

So, Bapuji says ‘When I was giving a very difficult lesson, right at that moment he left that place, he went away.

At that time I had forgotten about it.

When the whole class was finished, then I looked for him and I didn’t find him.

Then I asked the other students, I said ‘When did he leave?’ He had stayed just a little bit and had left.

Then I didn’t feel right, I said “This was a very important lesson I was giving and he left.”

So all the goats left.

He came playing in, I never [inaudible].

That way he ran away so I was greatly distant.

I called him and I said ‘Why did you run away?’ And gave him a heavy slap.

And he went in crying.

After a short time, I felt “‘Why did I punish him?”

I felt very bad that I had never punished a child, and I loved him so much, why did I punish him?

My mind was greatly disturbed.

Why did I get so angry on this small child?

I was very famous in that area, specially working with children.

Everybody believed that I loved children very much.

After an hour, I regained my balance, then I called him close, then I loved him.

I told him that I was too much angry so I punished you.

But now I will never do it punish you again.

Then I took him to the city.

And I bought him all the toys that he would like.

That day I got him everything he wanted.

Bapuji says, “I had taken fifty rupees in my pocket. In those days fifty is a very large lot of money.”

And he says, “I would get him anything he wants. That was the price of that one slap.”

I feel like from these steps I have grown [inaudible].

Whenever I have been angry on someone, wherever I have become disturbed, whenever I have done injustice to somebody, my heart has been greatly disturbed and painful.

Bapuji says, “Many people come from many different fields, but whenever some new person comes and if I cannot very closely and attentively listen to what they have to say, when I cannot satisfy them, when I don’t feel they got what they want it, it disturbs me.”

To pay attention to everyone, even the most minutest detail that when he got married and left, Bapuji said, I hadn’t seen his wife, because they are closed ones, and so he was asking very shy, so when she came Bapuji was happy.

So, as long as we do not behave or act so that it satisfies our own self, then until then we will not get the joy of life.

Bapuji says, most of the times I do everything that every disciple asks me to do, and that is why I get a lot confused.


GURUDEV [translating]:

[inaudible] had told from the room that Bapuji when you go out please don’t sit more than one or two minutes because we want to do some seva and look what happened!

GURUDEV [laughing]:

Bapuji says My son, I can understand everything, but I do my way.

Because until I satisfy my mind I go on doing what I am doing.

When Ma Om Shanti wanted to talk with me, with Panchala as an interpreter, while as soon as I had found that it was the bhakti yog, then Vinit was more suitable so I had to call him, to satisfy you.

Once that Bapuji had already determined that he will talk to you through Vinit and it was appropriate because you had done sadhana and Vinit Muni would be the appropriate interpreter because he has done sadhana.

GURUDEV: [Gurudev and Bapuji talk in Gujarati, Bapuji is saying the word ‘interpreter’] Translator [Bapuji and Gurudev laugh].

Bapuji says ‘That doesn’t sound too good word isn’t there any other better word?’ [Gurudev asks someone]: What other word, do you know?

SISTER: Translator.

GURUDEV: Translator.

Bapuji said that is also not good.

Any other word?

Bapuji says it is not possible to have no other word, you can get the feeling out of other word.

[Someone speaks to Bapuji in Gujarati]


Once I was calling Bapuji “I am going to give workshop.” Then he said “What is that, workshop?”

Because it sounds like mechanical workshop, you know, the wood workshop, he said “You must find some better word for it.”

GURUDEV [translating]:

Bapuji says, ‘Since my age fifteen I have been studying literature and literature has been my subject study in depth, and so that is my main subject.

As soon as there are such words, I don’t feel comfortable.

[Bapuji speaks and everybody laughs]


Bapuji says ‘I know about four, five thousand words in English.

I don’t know the spellings, but I have lived among the educated people from the very childhood, and so I have heard many words and I know the meanings.’

[Bapuji and Gurudev talk in Gujarati]

GURUDEV [translating]:

The translations are always effective if they catch the meaning of it, rather than literal translations.

But that cannot work in the research work.

So the article that Bapuji says I have written on idol worship and Sanatana Dharma, it is very scientific in its nature, and there the essence cannot work.

It has to be proper translation.

Bapuji says that Yogeshwar had from the very beginning requested one lecture on idol worship and one on Sanatana Dharma.

Bapuji said ‘This is very research oriented kind of an article, so I have written in a very shortest possible way, and yet, kept the scientific attitude in it.’

Bapuji says ‘I can easily write two-hundred-page booklet on that.’ Some of the subjects are not related to the kind of society here, that is why he had to keep it more for the western world.

So, when I will see him, I will discuss with him as to how he sees it.

So, before that I had started getting the translations for him.

Only that translation is checked by different individuals, then only it could be correct and thorough.

If the translation is not done properly, then it will not create the desired effect that Bapuji is trying to see.

Bapuji said ‘Yesterday I have mentioned that idol worship will first begin in America and it will grow throughout America.

Because it is a physical it is an aspect of physical science.

As soon as they see the scientific point of view in idol worship, they will have to accept it.

And they will definitely accept it, there is no doubt about it.

But this is not my prophecy.

This is my guess from the psychology point of view.

Because psychology is within yoga.

So, the prophecy is within psychology.

When the saints have said some of the future events, they haven’t said it in the form of prophecy or prediction.

They have looked at it in the form of psychological [Gurudev addresses to Bapuji in Gujarati asking something]

[Bapuji replies]

GURUDEV: I was telling Bapuji that there are some authors who write the imaginary novels that write that will happen hundred years from now or fifty years from now.

Then Bapuji said, “Let alone that, but what is written in Bhagavad Gita is happening now it is an old scripture.”

[Bapuji speaks and everybody laughs]

GURUDEV [translating]:

There is a description as to what would be the condition in the Kali Yuga, age of darkness, they said ‘You will not be able the distinction between boy and a girl.’ In western world it is true.

There are many such things that are described there which are actually happening and there are many things.

It can be called a prophecy because it comes within yoga, and yet in a way it is a psychological truth.

But when everybody pulls it and attributes it all to yoga and make prophecy a part of yoga then I don’t like it.

It becomes a miracle oriented yoga, which Bapuji doesn’t care for.

So, in Malav there was one sister who used to serve and she came down, and bowed down and cried.

So she was serving Bapuji so Bapuji said ‘Why are you crying?’ After I I stayed still for a while and then I said ‘Why are you crying, my daughter?’ ‘Because I have lost my buffalo.’ For her, that is a lot.

For the last two, three days the buffalo, I can’t find it, she has gone away somewhere.’ And it costs six, seven hundred rupees in India, it is very much for a person.

Then in order to make her laugh, as a father, that’s why I wanted to make her laugh, so I told her that I will go in samadhi and try to see where your buffalo is.

[Everybody laughs]

Can anyone really go into samadhi to find a buffalo?

If they could find any buffalos in samadhi, when would we find God?

Then she laughed.

The other sister was sitting there, ‘Because Bapuji is laughing, you will definitely find your buffalo.’

Next day she found her buffalo.

Bapuji says ‘God is a real big comedian too.

He put the credit on my name,’ he says.

One has to be careful about all these things.

A saint should not take any miracle on his name.

Give it all to the name of God, and see he is doing it.

You will be free from it.

That is the most honest way.

There is nothing no other way higher than that.

[microphone noise, harmonium]

Bapuji leads a chant to Rama.

Gurudev lead pranams.

Bapuji speaks.

GURUDEV [translates]:

Bapuji says ‘I thought they were sixty year old children, instead of they came out to be six year old.’

[Children chant ‘Love is something that you give it away’ to Bapuji, accompanied by guitar]

[Gurudev speaks to Bapuji in Gujarati]

GURUDEV: That was beautiful.

Who made this song?

It was beautiful. A CHILD: We did it at the ashram.

GURUDEV: Did you?

[Everybody laughs]

[Gurudev translates this to Bapuji and whispers to this child: ‘Bow down to Bapuji, touch Bapuji’s feet, be good girls. I love you’].

[Bapuji speaks]

GURUDEV [translating]:

My travel to foreign country was almost accidentally arranged.

It would be proper if I said that I wasn’t the one who was planning.

Where I stayed there, in my residence, I simply moved from one room to the other, and I do not go out anywhere.

I do not meet people either.

In only last Sunday of the month I meet people.

Other than that Bapuji remains in seclusion.

And even then, when he would come once a month, he will not talk and engage in talk in any form.

I would simply sing one or two bhajans and then go back in.

Under these circumstances it is almost impossible for me to plan to come here.

Another thing, I had no other purpose in my coming over here.

It is true that my several disciples are running yoga ashrams and yoga centers in different parts in foreign countries.

And they have been inviting me often to come to these countries.

But I used to avoid the invitations.

But this time, the incident happened in such a way that at that time Amrit and Yogeshwar, both [inaudible].

So, at that time I consented ‘Okay, my son, I am coming to America.’ Both of them are great [inaudible].

Both of them are most kind.

This way my travel is mainly arranged with an intention to greet you all, to give you darshan.

I have not come here to spread the religion or knowledge